Ferians and zooanthropes

[Drako Slyith]

Personally I genocide ferians for fun once I get my end game setup.

[ThePrivateer]

Personally I genocide ferians for fun once I get my end game setup.

Yeah, that's how you ended up with 8 angry ferian warriors trying to blow you up.. >.>

[Drako Slyith]

Yeah, that's how you ended up with 8 angry ferian warriors trying to blow you up.. >.>

That was different. I was genociding them because I needed cash and chose to do it the honest(er) way and not ruin millions of teenagers lives by selling illegal drugs at metro stations.

[ThePrivateer]

Yeah, that's how you ended up with 8 angry ferian warriors trying to blow you up.. >.>

That was different. I was genociding them because I needed cash and chose to do it the honest(er) way and not ruin millions of teenagers lives by selling illegal drugs at metro stations.

Sooooo. It's better to genoicde innocent, hardworking neo-humans than to sell some drugs to some addicts, who will get their drugs anyway?

Something about your morals isn't quite adding up -- Mass Murder is far worse than drug trafficking. -_-

(I sense a thread coming on...what's the worse/best thing you have done in Transcendence and then justify it)

[Drako Slyith]

Except its called a Ferian hive I think. They act like bugs, their ships look like bugs, and so as far as I can tell they are bugs. So what's worse? stepping on an insect or enabling teenagers to ruin their much longer and more suffering lives?

[ThePrivateer]

Except its called a Ferian hive I think. They act like bugs, their ships look like bugs, and so as far as I can tell they are bugs. So what's worse? stepping on an insect or enabling teenagers to ruin their much longer and more suffering lives?

Hey, where's a lore buff when you need one?

Aren't Ferians still somewhat human? What's the word? It starts with a "D" or something. Can't remember it. When you first go to the Parliament in St Kat's, one of the the guys is going on about it...anyway, I'm still saying that preying on poor little miners is a bit mean.

I'm not saying I never genoicide Ferrians, but I do try to keep it to a minimum, thus my above comment about getting the Plasma Torch, but I can't think of a good reason of why it's OK to murder hundreds of Ferians (often across several star systems), just to steel all the Chrominium Gas and Xenotite Ore they have spent years trying to accumulate (for whatever reason).

As for the druggies - we can safely assume that if you don't sell to them, they'll get their drugs anyway because we all see those T-31's roaming about the place loaded up on drugs. I'm not saying that you should sell drugs either, but when it comes down to it, murder is murder -- just because I sell some Laudenum, doesn't guarantee that every single case of it will instantly kill someone - but putting my Tev9 bolt through the windscreen of a Ferrian miner is guaranteed to kill him/her/it.

[Drako Slyith]

As for the druggies - we can safely assume that if you don't sell to them, they'll get their drugs anyway because we all see those T-31's roaming about the place loaded up on drugs. I'm not saying that you should sell drugs either, but when it comes down to it, murder is murder -- just because I sell some Laudenum, doesn't guarantee that every single case of it will instantly kill someone - but putting my Tev9 bolt through the windscreen of a Ferrian miner is guaranteed to kill him/her/it.

Yes, but as you said with the druggies. Just because you don't shoot them doesn't mean someone else will refrain.

Also, they have decent cannons on them. If they cared for individuals, as insects don't, they would either run or fight when you shot them. But they don't. More proof that they're more insect than human.

[ThePrivateer]

As for the druggies - we can safely assume that if you don't sell to them, they'll get their drugs anyway because we all see those T-31's roaming about the place loaded up on drugs. I'm not saying that you should sell drugs either, but when it comes down to it, murder is murder -- just because I sell some Laudenum, doesn't guarantee that every single case of it will instantly kill someone - but putting my Tev9 bolt through the windscreen of a Ferrian miner is guaranteed to kill him/her/it.

Yes, but as you said with the druggies. Just because you don't shoot them doesn't mean someone else will refrain.

Also, they have decent cannons on them. If they cared for individuals, as insects don't, they would either run or fight when you shot them. But they don't. More proof that they're more insect than human.

Congrats on 250 posts!

What cannons do Ferians have? Plasma Torches don't really count as weapons, and they do attack you -- but I'll admit it is rare; however, they have the Warriors to protect them. I know what you'll say to that - "insects have warriors too". But I say that is more reason not to kill them, because they obviously place a value on their lives - though the miners themselves may not often attack, if the colony is attacked, the warriors will defend it. Thus, they place a value on what they own - because they want to protect their home (and the stockpiles of gas/ore inside).

Furthermore:

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You enter into a vast chamber, only partially pressurized. Large metal maws connsume a small fortune in rocks and ores delivered by Ferian miners. Beneath them you see various vessels shrouded by the cranes and girders of a shipyard. Most of the vessels are new Ferian miners being created out of raw materials. A few are much larger and have a more sinister shape.

That's what the player sees when they dock at the Ferian colony. The Ferians can't be mere insects - how else would you propose they build spaceships in a shipyard? More proof that the Ferians are not simple minded creatures that should be genocided, but real beings.

And sofar, I have neither seen nor heard in any lore of the Ferians being exploited by anybody other than the player.

Edit: BTW, sorry Pyro for crashing your plasma cannon adoration thread! xD We're turning this into another Amilir vs. Atarlost style debate!

[Drako Slyith]

yeah, sorry about that.
Anyway, but hives protect the hive itself. If you look, a single ant dead only brings out a few scouts to see what happened. If, however, you step on the hive, all the warriors come out to defend it. Just like the Ferians. They only attack if you destroy the entire hive. If one dies, they just go on with their business.

About the intelligence, that holds no bearing. They are obviously neo-humans, but what I'm saying is they're more like insects. Siafu ants will create highways through a forest and build intricate structures. They are highly organized for ants, but they are still ants. Bees create a complex honeycomb structure. Most insects are capable of creating structures. Surely insects that are part human could create a ship. But, the fact is, even though wasps can create complicated structures like bees, you still exterminate them. Dogs are eaten in much of Asia though they are very intelligent, able to learn nearly any trick and repeat it. .

[ThePrivateer]

yeah, sorry about that.
Anyway, but hives protect the hive itself. If you look, a single ant dead only brings out a few scouts to see what happened. If, however, you step on the hive, all the warriors come out to defend it. Just like the Ferians. They only attack if you destroy the entire hive. If one dies, they just go on with their business.

About the intelligence, that holds no bearing. They are obviously neo-humans, but what I'm saying is they're more like insects. Siafu ants will create highways through a forest and build intricate structures. They are highly organized for ants, but they are still ants. Bees create a complex honeycomb structure. Most insects are capable of creating structures. Surely insects that are part human could create a ship. But, the fact is, even though wasps can create complicated structures like bees, you still exterminate them. Dogs are eaten in much of Asia though they are very intelligent, able to learn nearly any trick and repeat it. .

I think I may be forced to concede my point here... >.>

I can't think of anything else left to say -- from what you just said then, you provide a very strong case for the Ferians being insects (or perhaps psychologically insect-like).

The Ferians are one of the stranger inhabitants of the Transcendence world and I would be all for hearing a bit of lore from George...in any case, it would appear that even if the Ferians are not physically insects (being neo-humans), they do at least exhibit strong insect-like psychology and behaviour. On that basis, I have to concede that the Ferians are less-than humans and thus humans (and their drug-addictions) should come first, so given the choice where you could do only one thing, it would perhaps be more ethical to attack the Ferians than to provide drugs to humans, because the ones of your own species should come first.

I still, however, think that genociding Ferians "just because" is still quite ruthless -- sure, people eat dogs, but I would never kill a dog to eat it (in normal circumstances). Just the same as I would not deliberately go out into the middle of a field and destroy a termite nest and kill several thousand or million ants -- it's unnecessary, and a life is a life (but that raises other issues, so let's not discuss them now).

Given the choice, I think the player should be forced to think twice about recklessly destroying the Ferians, because they are, more or less human, and more importantly (from a game perspective) a neutral faction. Thus the player should have to suffer some kind of consequence beside the three warriors when they attack a colony or murder the miners.

I feel that George (or a modder) might be able to work on this a bit -- for instance, currently, we assume that 'red blips are enemies and they deserve to be destroyed'. However, in the case of the Huari, we find that it is possible to change the way a faction views you. In a similar way, mass murdering the Ferians should come at a cost -- for instance, another faction might begin to hate you (for instance, a faction that relies on the ferian's products might begin targeting you etc.)

[Drako Slyith]

I agree. The ringers should get mad if you kill x number of ferian colonies and not let you dock or something, as they are who the ferians sell to.

I do have to point out however that need is a highly subjective term. For example, humans do not need to kill cows, but they do. Sport fishing as well, it is not necessary, but it is fun.

[Resident-Pyromaniac]

I personally Have no qaulms about the mass destruction of Ferian miners, I actually use their attitude towards the Hive to my advantage. Kill all ferians in the area, and their Hive is ripe for the pickins'.
worthy of note, I was using version 09.9 and have only recently switched to 1.01. I must say, the game is way more polished.

[digdug]

Heh, so you are going to have a nice surprise when you try the same tactic with 1.01 ferians

[Resident-Pyromaniac]

Dogone it! you mean the ferians are actually intelligent in 1.01?
crud-o. bah. I'll just have to improve my skills then. :(

[Drako Slyith]

Not quite intelligent (as I've proved in the recent debate.) But they do throw a ship to attack you if you take a sizable chunk out of their swarm.